Bella Swan Cullen

[Jules]

I've always sort of thought that Bella behaves amazingly well considering the situations she's always thrown into. I mean, she's not powerful, sh's not crazy talented or crazy lucky, at least in the first three novels. She's put into a situation out of her control and she reacted as best as any pereson could.

Yeah, Ishe fell apart after Edward left her. But it's not like it was this random guy she met at K-mart two weeks before. Ths is not to say that someone couldn't be devastated in that situation, just that that's not reallly magical like Edward and Bella. Becaus their relationship is special, like an imprinting. The only thing I can compare it to is being able to hear the voice of angels, their sweet heavenly voices singing in your mind, and then, whoosh, all you can hear is your pet hamster. It would be shocking, numbing, and I thinkit would feel like you were deprived of a basic need, that you had died,or could never hear anything so beatiful again. And likely not something anyone could over.

She did not handle the break-up well. But she was healing. And I think she could have done, with or wihtout Jacob. It' human nature tyo survive aginst all odd. However, I stress that she was not in a very human relationship. I can't remember the specific Hindu diety, but I know a human was in love with him. Her parents locked her away in room one night, and she repeate is name over and over again, her silent prayer because she obsessed and in love. And in return he brought her up to the heavens to reign with him for all eternity. I onl mention this because I think this is more like Edward and Bella's love than a regular highschool romance. Would that girl have survied? Maybe, but it igth be slow and she would always remember her love with holy reverence and respect.

As for her feeling superior, I very muc believe that the sense of superiority and indiffence are very different things. She never goes out of her way to be rude to them. And yeah, she neglects her friends for Edward. That's not okay. But he does, too. Her spends every moment he has with her. But to most people, Edward's devotion is okay, while Bella's not. On second note, when Edward comes back, Bella does not forget Jacob. She calls him and worries about him. And then when she realizes she is hurting both Edward and Jacob by not letting Jacob go, she finally does let them go. She her mistake and sets out to correct it, even if it hurts both JAcob and herself. ANd who can really say that Jaocb was better off waiting around for Bella? I think she did the right thing.

And as for her being selfish when she was pregnat, I think that's understandable. I think I read Breaking Dawn differnetly. That aching and longing for Jacob disppeared after Bella had Renesmee. And yes, Bella loved Jacob, but nned to be together, to have Jacob nearnby and "torture" him, was not Bella's fault. It was Renesmee the enre time. And I agreed with Leah, but at the same time, I'm prbably not going to yell at a dying person, and when I read Breaking Dawn, that's how I saw it. Bella was inches away from dying and they were all trying to make her as happy and comfortable as possible. Neith do I blame Bella after the pregnancy becasue it was clear Renesmee was that pull for Jacob the entire time.

I also didn't thnk Bella's reaction toward the imprinting that weird. I remember thinking, who is Jacob to take Bella's baby awayjust because he's imprinted. I probaby woudn't care if it was the pope, I'd have screamed bloody murdr at a person who snatched my baby away from me. Even if it was for her own prtection. I was surprsed by how pushy Jacob was, and besides, it seemed as if in the beginning Jacob infringed upon Bella's right to as a mother. One specific time, Jacob wouldn't let Bella hold Renesmee until Alice assured him it was safe. This was when Charlie was coming over and it was already clear Bella was safe around her baby. HER BABy, not Jacob's.

Nor is eh neglectful. She loves her baby and takes care of her. Bella didn't have a back-up plan for Rosalie, ALice, or even Edward. But she had one for Renesmee, who she, as well as 30? other vampires would sacrifice their lives for. She tucks her daughter in and reads to her and will spend hours just listeing to her memories. She even takes her hunting. ANd I don't think she just hands her choldren off to other poeple. When she leaves Nessie at Charlie's, she's visiting J. Jenks, someone Alce believed was necessary.

That's all. I'm tired. For me, that was a lot of typing.

[holdingoutforjacob]

bella's "dying" was something she brought upon herself. not that it's not understandable. but it's not something she should be pitied for, and its certainly not an excuse for her treatment of jacob, and in that, leah was absolutely correct.

as for her feelings of superiority, it's different for edward. he had no other friends and made no other connections. bella did, and then dropped them. that's very different from not making them in the first place.

and then for jacob's "infringement" issue. jacob IMPRINTED on nessie. so he will do ANYTHING to keep her safe. just like edward would do for bella. jacob hasn't seen bella since she became a vampire. he has no idea what her control level is - no one does. she only JUST found that out on the hunting trip.

also, the theory that nessie was jake's pull to bell the entire series i find to be ridiculous, but that's something for the jake thread i believe.

[Jules]

Edward has other friends: Alice and Emmet for instance. But as I said, Bella didn't droe all for freinds, like Jacob. As for Alice and Jess, well, you're right. She shouldn't have forgtten them.

Jacob even said Nessie was the reason behind his strange pull to Bella. He said it when trying to explain the imprinting to Bella before she luunged at him. And there was no reason for him to be so worried about Nessie's safety when Charlie was coming. It was clear Bella wouldn't hurt her already. Anyway, I think you and I just disagree who has a stronger claim, the mother or the imprintee?

And Bella didn't bring anything upon herself. Who knows if she would have agreed to get pregant if she knew the cost in the first place? But I think she should be pitied. She wasn't carrying full term to make anyone unhappy or sad; she was doing it because she loved that child. And Jacob could have walked away at any time. Bella did not chain him to her bedside.

[Jules]

And I don't think Renesmee was the pull between Jacob and Bella the entire seris. Just when she was pregant.

[holdingoutforjacob]

i think you mean angela - not alice. and edward had friends, yes, but they were also his "relatives" whom he lived with. it's quite a different situation don't you think? he chose not to make ties to outsiders. and he didn't break those ties in his relationship to bella, she developed ties with them. edward should have reciprocated that.

nessie was MAYBE the reason jake couldn't walk away during the pregnancy. that i think is definitely a possibility. not a certainty, but a possibility.

i certainly think that at this stage bella has WAY more right to nessie than jake. absolutely. it will change as she grows older, but that's natural.

i thought you were talking about when she FIRST came back after she first hunted, when he devised that "test". because that, to me, was only common sense. the charlie thing though, that could have been because bella's control was already weakened. and i don't recall there being a huge issue over that when charlie came. i think edward wanted jake to take her, in fact, but bella thought it would keep her calm...something to that effect. i don't have my book on me, sorry.

anyway, that definitely, i don't think, is jake's intention.

[cataclysm]

snip
Jacob even said Nessie was the reason behind his strange pull to Bella. He said it when trying to explain the imprinting to Bella before she luunged at him. And there was no reason for him to be so worried about Nessie's safety when Charlie was coming. It was clear Bella wouldn't hurt her already. Anyway, I think you and I just disagree who has a stronger claim, the mother or the imprintee?

snip.

I believe Jacob was referring to not being able to stay away from Bella post-pregnancy. He loved Bella for herself before he imprinted on nessie, he didn't love bella because he was about to imprint on nessie. Once nessie came into existence (even inside bella) she began to have a stronger pull on him. I think Jacob even refers to Bella's pregnant belly as having its own gravitational pull.

As for the 'claim' thing. It's not about who has the stronger claim to nessie. Once jacob imprinted on her, he was no more able to not obsess over her well being as edward was able to not obsess over bella's. e.g. When Edward kept bella from seeing jake by disabling her truck in eclipse. Bella had already been around jake in wolf form and even the pack for weeks and not been hurt. In fact, jake had protected her from paul. There was really no reason for Edward to be so overprotective, but he was still afraid that she'd get hurt. So afraid, that he went to extremes to 'protect' her from someone who obviously loved her.

[Jules]

Yes, it is a different situation. The thing is my best friend is also my sister. If she were to suddenly spend all her time with her new boyfreind I'd probably mind, even if I saw how in love she was with him. But somebody else might react diffently.

Alice didn't want Bella to hold Renesmme when Charlie came, but only because Nessie blocked her visions. Not because it wasn't safe.

And I think Jacob's intentions were alwasys good, but I think he should have ceded control to Bella more, being as she is the mom. I do not think he had anything bad or evil in mind, rest assured.

[Jules]

I don't think he loved Bella because of Renesmee. But when he was expalining the imprinting, he asked Bella if she noticed that the tremdous pull between had vanished? She didn't acknowledge that aloud to Jacob, but them Jacob said, that it had been Renesmee all the time, that even when Bella was pregnat , he and Nessie had to be toether. I think that was the imprinting.

[niski]

Bella really got on my nerves in Breaking Dawn. First off, the whole pregnancy thing seemed really selfish to me. She knew that if she died it would hurt Edward and not just Edward but Charlie and Renee and Jacob and the cullens as well. She knew Edward would kill himself but she wants to have his baby so then none of that matters.

I also didn't like how she kept Jacob around. So not only did she have to hurt him throughout New Moon and Eclipse but she had to continue hurting him in Breaking Dawn. She keeps him around to watch her die and be around Edward even though she knows it's painful. And then she plans on turning into a vampire after she has the baby which will be even more painful for jake to watch.

And then her reaction to jacob imprinting. Talk about selfish. So she can put him through all that pain and torment and then when he finally has a shot at happiness she wants to take it all away for her own petty reasons? I actually disliked all of the cullens reactions to the imprinting. I mean didn't Jake just save all of their hineys at the cost of his old pack or was I missing something? Edward and Bella owe Jacob their lives and more but want to keep him away from his imprintee. That part infuriated me. Edward can read minds so he knows how jake feels and Bella knew how imprinting worked but disregarded it because she wanted nessie all to herself. The fact that she was willing to put jake through more pain just made me so angry. I just wanted to jump in and scream "Don't you remeber all that he's done for you!" Gosh. She was so melodramatic and hypersensitive after the transformation. She almost killed Jacob just for imprinting on her daughter.I just couldn't like her as much as a character after that moment.

[KaseyHeartEdward]

Okay i love Jacob he is a sweetheart and i am sad that he had to go through so much fo Bella. But he had a choice. he could have left her but he chose not to. It isn't like Bella had him straped to a chair. I believe he did the staping himself. And that is what we do for the people we love even when the hurt us so we stay and hope things will change. Jacob knew his chance with Bella was no more. But he had hope and that is why he stayed.

And being selfish with having the baby even though you might die. Honestly that happens to many women i believe. When one realizes that they have life inside them you just can't give it up. The baby is part of you. Im not sure i have never been close to that situation. SO i wouldn't know. but i am pretty sure a mother would ask you mother. If they knew that they might die giving birth to you and would they still try to have you. they would say yes. Because mothers will sacrifice their lives for their children.

Her family still mattered do you really think that she wanted to leave them? To leave the love of her life that she would have a life with.?

Then with the imprinting yes the cullens were mad but i think the reason is, is because they didn't understand how imprinting worked. I think they thought that it was like Jacob was totally in love with Nessie. Like in love, in love. They didn't realize that it was like a protecter sorta big brother kind of love. And Bella was just upset that during the three days she was turning she couldn't be with her baby. And she was afraid her baby wouldn't know her or want her.