Edward Cullen #4

[amethyst]

thanks Navarre. . . amethyst is my favorite stone and it is my favourite colour too.
In other words - I forgot to mention- but this is Malaz. While i was setting up this one, i was unaware of that when i posted (if that makes sense. i was multi-tasking, causes confusion. i don't recommend it) I rather detest my old one so i am going to delete it and use this one now and i don't want to go back and forth between these accounts so if anyone knows how to delete an account, tell me! - otherwise i'll PM a mod. thanks.

sorry for the confusion. Hopefully i don't confuse anyone.

[Jazz Girl]

I have two questions that I have thought long and hard over and have not been able to come up with a clear answer to either.
#1. In NM when the Cullen's vote to turn Bella into a vampire Edward is furious. It says that when he and Bella returned to her house he paced back and fourth calculating, then that's when he asks Bella what she would want more than anything in the world, she says for him to change her, then he asks her what she would give in return for that right? So, what makes him finally willing to accept her turning into a vampire? What is his thought process? Why does he decide to give in? Also, do you think that before Bella even said anything about him being the one to change her that he had those same feelings? That he wanted to be the one to change her (that if she was going to be changed, he was going to be the one to do it?) I know that I am not wording this very clearly. I just have never quite had a grasp on how he goes from being so furious at the idea of her changing to not only accepting it but agreeing to be the one who does it.

1) I think Edward knew that Bella had her mind set firmly and he could not change that, so in order to sweeten the pot for him, he gave her an alternative that would help him to get what he wanted - Bella as his wife and no other way out of it for her if she wanted HIM to do it. It was a huge concession for both.
Edward turning her and Bella marrying him.

Navarre, I don't know that I agree 100%. I think that a larger part of it was that Edward realized that, as determined as Bella was and as resolved as Alice and Carlisle were to support her, one of them would eventually do it. Edward wanted to marry Bella desperately. But, he also knew that Bella didn't want to go through a wedding. I think he was counting on Bella's opposition to marriage to help delay her, give him time to try to convince her not to be changed. In the end, when he saw the inevitability of it, I think, like Bella, there was some part of changing her himself that did attract Edward, an additional bond that it created between them.

#2. This question is not at all connected with the first. This is more of a curiousity question really. At the end of Eclipse, when Edward and Bella are at their meadow and Edward tells her that the deal is off and that he is ready to give into her demands, do you think that if Bella would not have been strong enough to stop him, and tell him no that they should wait to have sex that he really would have??? In other words, if she would have been willing at that time do you think he really would have? I am torn on this one, I keep waivering between yes and no. I would like to hear your thoughts before I give you mine.

Hmmmm..... this is where I'm actually really proud of Bella for the stand she takes. I think, in the end, Edward's overprotective instincts for Bella would have kicked in. I think they would have made it a lot further than they had up until that point. But, in the end, it wouldn't have happened.

[SenorGimp]

Oh
Hey malaz, I guess I should start calling you amethyst, then?
Well, I imagine that to delete an account, you would do so through the User Control Panel, though I'm not sure exactly how to do it...
Good luck, I'm sure you'll quickly establish yourself a fine reputation with your new account name, but I must admit..
I enjoy the idea of now having a bunch of more posts than you do.
I've been trying to catch up with you and HOFJ for quite a while.
Half the competition gone!
mwahahahaha
jk

[eclipserox]

I have two questions that I have thought long and hard over and have not been able to come up with a clear answer to either.
#1. In NM when the Cullen's vote to turn Bella into a vampire Edward is furious. It says that when he and Bella returned to her house he paced back and fourth calculating, then that's when he asks Bella what she would want more than anything in the world, she says for him to change her, then he asks her what she would give in return for that right? So, what makes him finally willing to accept her turning into a vampire? What is his thought process? Why does he decide to give in? Also, do you think that before Bella even said anything about him being the one to change her that he had those same feelings? That he wanted to be the one to change her (that if she was going to be changed, he was going to be the one to do it?) I know that I am not wording this very clearly. I just have never quite had a grasp on how he goes from being so furious at the idea of her changing to not only accepting it but agreeing to be the one who does it.

#2. This question is not at all connected with the first. This is more of a curiousity question really. At the end of Eclipse, when Edward and Bella are at their meadow and Edward tells her that the deal is off and that he is ready to give into her demands, do you think that if Bella would not have been strong enough to stop him, and tell him no that they should wait to have sex that he really would have??? In other words, if she would have been willing at that time do you think he really would have? I am torn on this one, I keep waivering between yes and no. I would like to hear your thoughts before I give you mine.

P.S. I am sorry if these topics have already been discussed. I am new to this, forgive me please.

1. I still think he was very much opposed to Bella being changed and frustrated that most of his family had voted against him. I think he had a feeling that Bella would prefer for Edward to change her, and used that to try to delay changing her. During the honeymoon in BD, he considers having sex with Bella again even though he does not want to if she agrees to go to college for awhile before being changed. He is constantly trying to delay changing her. He never accepts it. He never WANTS to change her. He doesn't change her until it is absolutely necessary if he doesn't want to lose her forever.

2. Absolutely not. Edward is very strong and very controlled. He has always been able to control himself when kissing Bella. Bella always pushes him to go further, and Edward is always able to stop things before he hurts her. He was too worried that having sex with her would hurt, or even kill, her. It took him a long time and a lot of preparation to sleep with her during the honeymoon. He was not ready (in the sense that he thought he would hurt her, the risk was too great) in Eclipse. He would have eventually stopped things if Bella hadn't.

[navarre]

I do like how he managed to get a 'yes' out of her regarding marriage. He would give her a real honeymoon, one that she was desperate to have(completely understandable) and he got her to say that he could pay for Dartmouth, buy her a fast car, anything. Then on pg. 450 in Eclipse he nails her to the wall:

"I wasn"'t born yesterday". He chuckled in my ear. "Out of the two of us, which do you think is more unwilling to give the other what they want? You just promised to marry me before you do any changing, but if I give in tonight, what guarantee do I have that you won't go running off to Carlisle in the morning? I am - clearly- much less reluctant to give you what you want. Therefore....you first."

"I have to marry you first?" I asked in disbelief.
"That's the deal - take it or leave it. compromise, remember?"

She thought she had it under control and now she is engaged. That was one of the best parts of the book.
Very, very cunning on his part.

Thank heavens, she realized she was winning too when she saw him at the altar. *swoon* Yum!

[SenorGimp]

They both made off pretty well, in my opinion...

[ariadnee]

#2. This question is not at all connected with the first. This is more of a curiousity question really. At the end of Eclipse, when Edward and Bella are at their meadow and Edward tells her that the deal is off and that he is ready to give into her demands, do you think that if Bella would not have been strong enough to stop him, and tell him no that they should wait to have sex that he really would have??? In other words, if she would have been willing at that time do you think he really would have? I am torn on this one, I keep waivering between yes and no. I would like to hear your thoughts before I give you mine.

I appear to be alone here. My answer is - yes, absolutely. There's a line in there - where Edward "squares his shoulders." I'm certain he's busy convincing himself that giving into her desires, whatever they are, is better than following through with his plans. He knows full well what the consequences are. He would have tried to have given her what she wanted, and likely, he would have succeeded, like he did on his wedding night. She would have ended up bruised, at the very least, and I'm not certain what would have followed from there. But I do know that he was serious, right then and there, in the meadow. My feeling is that he would have followed through.

Thanks for listening. -Ariadnee

[eclipserox]

When Edward had his rebellious stage and ate humans who were bad criminals, he was acting as judge, jury and executioner. I was just thinking that he was acting somewhat similarly to the Volturi. The Volturi considered themselves the ultimate judge in the vampire world. SM has said that she set up the confrontation in BD to play out like a court room drama with the Volturi acting as the judge, not a battle. Obviously, the Volturi were unethical and had alternate motivations than serving justice. Edward is very kind and ethical. I'm not trying to draw too close a comparison. But, this one similarity got me to thinking, if the Volturi had recruited Edward while he was in his rebellious stage, does anyone think he would have considered joining them? He was killing people anyways. He was taking on the role of judge. He was enjoying his power to read minds as well as his strength and ability to "punish" humans. He knew Carlisle had lived with the Volturi for awhile and was friends with some of them. I don't know that he would join them, but I think he might have considered it. I definitely think that if he had joined them, he would leave fairly quickly after seeing how they really operate.

[Esme echo]

Great questions, hrtwilight!
#1: I don't think Edward knew about Bella's aversion to marriage until that morning in her room after the family vote. I don't think they'd discussed it before, had they? I agree that he realized that it was going to happen, eventually, and he hoped that he could work something out that would delay Bella as long as possible . . . so she could get older and wiser. He was so afraid that she would hate him once she was a vampire, that she would eventually resent being changed.

#2: I'm sort of agreeing with ariadnee here . . . I'm not sure Edward would have stopped himself. (Do vampires have hormones?) It's so easy to underestimate the power of sex. . . so easy to change your mind about how far you'll go when things get intense! I'm so glad Bella decided to do things in the right order! Can you imagine what would have happened if she'd come home bruised, and Renesmee immediately began growing? What would Charlie have done??

ecipserox, great post! Edward has always struck me as a little self-righteous (sorry, Edward! You know I love you!) I'm not sure he would have joined the Volturi even in his rebellious stage, but it's a very intriguing idea!

[Kachiti]

#2: I'm sort of agreeing with ariadnee here . . . I'm not sure Edward would have stopped himself. (Do vampires have hormones?) It's so easy to underestimate the power of sex. . . so easy to change your mind about how far you'll go when things get intense! I'm so glad Bella decided to do things in the right order! Can you imagine what would have happened if she'd come home bruised, and Renesmee immediately began growing? What would Charlie have done??

You bring up a good point but after everything we know about Edward, I just can't picture Edward letting himself go like that. I mean the night before the wedding he was trying out get out of the sex after we're married deal.