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Re: Jacob Black

Postby diane771 » Tue May 26, 2009 1:31 pm

When reading that part I got the opinion that it was after the control and when the danger was gone. But not sure if I read that correctly.
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Re: Jacob Black

Postby Jazz Girl » Tue May 26, 2009 2:18 pm

diane771 wrote:When reading that part I got the opinion that it was after the control and when the danger was gone. But not sure if I read that correctly.


I always thought it was more a matter of the control rather than the danger. The existing pack will always be able to phase because the gene has been triggered. But, when the Cullens leave, there won't be any new additions to the pack because the "danger" that triggers the gene in the first place would have passed. There may be some pack members whose gene has been triggered but they haven't phased yet, so they will still join the pack. But, once the Cullens are gone for a solid length of time, the pack itself will stop growing in size.

As each wolf matures, they gain the ability and control to phase at will, controlling their phasing even in the face of anger, danger or other things that seem to make others with less control phase without thought. That's when they start aging again. But, as soon as they phase again, the aging process would be stopped. That's how I saw the ball of yarn anyway.
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Re: Jacob Black

Postby diane771 » Tue May 26, 2009 2:45 pm

That sound reasonable, I know when I went back last night I was tired and it was brought up in more than one place so I can go with that. Because if they did revert back to being only humans and the imprint was gone that could be a real big problem. The only thing I know is that the pack grew because of the vamps getting larger and with more risk.
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Re: Jacob Black

Postby holdingoutforjacob » Tue May 26, 2009 9:02 pm

diane771 wrote:Ok, lets say the Cullens disappears and the wolves revert back to just being human. Does that mean that they still imprint or not and if not what about Quil?


I think it's one of those things that once it starts you can't stop it. So it's not like Sam will just go back to being in love with Leah and Jacob won't be enslaved by his love for Nessie anymore. But since you have to phase once to imprint - it happens the first time you see your imprintee after you phase the first time, I think... - there would be no more imprinting.

I think stopping phasing altogether does have to do with control, but I don't think it's like the thirst the vampires have. I don't think they're always itching to go into wolf-mode so to speak. So I think that once you have control over not phasing every time your emotions go out of control, you can do it. It's all about control of the link between control/phasing, as I understand it.

It almost seems a waste - Jacob is supposedly the one with the best control, but he's the only one who can remain immortal and still stay with his imprintee.
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Re: Jacob Black

Postby diane771 » Tue May 26, 2009 9:23 pm

I am not really saying that Sam would go back to Leah, but with the imprinting the ties are so strong if you stop phasing some of that intense feelings might go? Because when Jacob was telling Bella about growing old and when they had control and didn't phase for a long period of time, he then went on to say that Sam was upset still about Leah and blamed the Cullens for that. in Imprinting chapter of Eclispe but it doesn't say what happens I guess when the Cullens move away and they don't have to have the wolves. But Sam does blame the Cullens for breaking up with Leah. Interesting because is Quil going to want Claire if the Cullens leave and Claire is still a child?
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Re: Jacob Black

Postby amethyst » Tue May 26, 2009 9:29 pm

They would still be imprinted upon their imprintees. Taha Aki started aging again in order to live a normal, healthy, human life with his third wife--which he imprinted upon--once she was murdered by the "cold one", he experience a rage he's never felt before and turned into a wolf to avenge her. I can only deduce that he was still attached to her as much as he was when he first imprinted.

Does anyone find it odd (to say the least) how Jacob is completely attached to Renesmee (he won't leave her side, almost ever) even three months after he imprinted upon her. In comparison to Quil and Claire (Claire doesn't live in La Push) Jacob's attachment doesn't seem normal to me. Or does the intensity of the imprinter differ from one person to another? I think other wise for numerous reasons. Also, why does Jacob stare at Renesmee like a "person staring at the sun for the first time" . . . It creeps me out, because I attribute this analogy to romantic relationships . . . Thanks for who ever offers their opinion ;)
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Re: Jacob Black

Postby diane771 » Tue May 26, 2009 9:45 pm

amethyst wrote:They would still be imprinted upon their imprintees. Taha Aki started aging again in order to live a normal, healthy, human life with his third wife--which he imprinted upon--once she was murdered by the "cold one", he experience a rage he's never felt before and turned into a wolf to avenge her. I can only deduce that he was still attached to her as much as he was when he first imprinted.

Does anyone find it odd (to say the least) how Jacob is completely attached to Renesmee (he won't leave her side, almost ever) even three months after he imprinted upon her. In comparison to Quil and Claire (Claire doesn't live in La Push) Jacob's attachment doesn't seem normal to me. Or does the intensity of the imprinter differ from one person to another? I think other wise for numerous reasons. Also, why does Jacob stare at Renesmee like a "person staring at the sun for the first time" . . . It creeps me out, because I attribute this analogy to romantic relationships . . . Thanks for who ever offers their opinion ;)


Well I think he was watching her closely before Bella awoke, then I think after all the drama at the end was over. I don't think Edward would approve of Jacob staying the night with Renesmee in the cottage with Bella and him :)
And yes it is strange because she is half vampire also, so it quite strange because aren't the imprinting on humans and Renesmee isn't just human? Maybe he looking at her because he just can't figure out If she will bite him or not, if he isn't careful :lol: :lol:
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Re: Jacob Black

Postby holdingoutforjacob » Tue May 26, 2009 9:52 pm

I'm not sure amethyst, but actually I found the descriptions of Jacob and Nessie to be very similar to that of Sam and Emily.

I think some of it may be attributed to SM trying to convince us all to believe in this relationship that she probably knew would have a hard time going over so well.

Either way, I'm pretty sure it said somewhere about how Sam couldn't wait to get back to Emily after their patrols in New Moon. And also, just because Claire and Quil don't live near each other doesn't mean he doesn't pine for her.

So I think it's simply a matter of how you take it. We really don't know enough to form very solid opinions, as far as I'm concerned. It really may just be Ms. Meyer's tendency towards the mushy writing style rearing it's head again.

Diane - I see where you're getting that idea, and in the rational world, it definitely makes more sense to me. But I think that what Sam might have meant by blaming the Cullens for hurting Leah was that he knew that if the Cullens hadn't come back, his wolf gene wouldn't have triggered, and if his wolf gene hadn't triggered, he wouldn't have had to leave Leah. I don't think that he thinks that when the Cullens leave it'll all go back to normal, because I think we've seen that's not how imprinting works, with the Taha Aki story that amethyst so kindly provided. You're logic definitely is sound though, it makes sense to me.
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Re: Jacob Black

Postby diane771 » Tue May 26, 2009 10:01 pm

Diane - I see where you're getting that idea, and in the rational world, it definitely makes more sense to me. But I think that what Sam might have meant by blaming the Cullens for hurting Leah was that he knew that if the Cullens hadn't come back, his wolf gene wouldn't have triggered, and if his wolf gene hadn't triggered, he wouldn't have had to leave Leah. I don't think that he thinks that when the Cullens leave it'll all go back to normal, because I think we've seen that's not how imprinting works, with the Taha Aki story that amethyst so kindly provided. You're logic definitely is sound though, it makes sense to me.

No you are right but when Jacob was telling Bella about growing up and imprint he said that Sam blamed the Cullens coming back and him phasing so he didn't imprint on Leah the woman that he loved. and had to hurt so bad. I just wonder about Leah turning that would also be a great spin off about the Quileutes.
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Re: Jacob Black

Postby vampirenerd » Tue May 26, 2009 11:23 pm

I agree that we don't know enough about the other wolves relationships to be able to tell if Jacob's attachment is normal or not. They could spend just as much time with their imprintees. And even if they didn't it wouldn't mean that they weren't wishing they could spend all their time with them.

Diane, I think that even though Sam did love Leah his new love for Emily overshadows that. IMO what he was upset about (in reference to the Cullens coming back and making him phase and then him imprinting on Emily) was that it hurt Leah. Yes, he loved Leah and I'm sure it hurt him but now he has Emily and Leah has nothing. I think that he cares enough about Leah still that he was upset b/c it hurt her so badly.
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