Bella Swan Cullen #3

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Re: Bella Swan Cullen #3

Postby Dovrebanen » Sat Jun 13, 2009 2:46 pm

Angelvamp wrote: I wonder how much the hope of seeing Edward again had to do with her still ticking. And I was wondering, if Edward never came back and Bella never saw him again, would she still feel like her life was worth living? This seems like the whole "If a tree falls in the forest..." thing. I mean, if she never sees him again, isn't that the same thing as him dying? How would she know if he did?

I don't see the fact that she never see him again as the same as him dying. It was the same for Edward. He could take anything, except Bella dying. He could leave her, but he had to know that she was alive. And when he thought she was dead, he wanted to kill himself. I think that was all Edward needed. He even said that if he had come back and found her happy, that he would have left again. It was all he needed.
Not sure it was quite the same for Bella. But I think she would stay alive regardless. She went to Italy to save Edward, knowing that she probably would not get to keep him even if she saved him. But she needed him to be alive. If he wasn't, she might as well be dead as well. So that leads me to believe that knowing that Edward was out there somewhere, helped her to stay alive. She needed to stay in Forks for instance, because she had to be where just some small part of him still lingered. As for how she would know if Edward died. I think Alice would have told her. If Edward had died, I think Alice would have come back and taken care of Bella. They couldn't possibly hide something like that from her. And anyway, it was safe to assume for Bella that no matter where Edward was, that he was alive.

Angelvamp wrote:I really appreciate the chance to prattle on and on in this forum and I'm so grateful to be privy to everyone's interesting and insightful posts! You guys totally make my day! :D Especially you, Dovrebanen, I gotta be honest. :)

Aw, thank you :) I'm glad you signed on here!
The Dark Knight wrote: Her motives for Rosalie in BD are interesting to say the least. Why her?

What about Charlie, he is forever changed by her decisions and not in a good way? How does this play into this?

Dark Knight, that is a lot of questions!
Rosalie...The reason she choose to rely in Rosalie in BD is pretty clear if you ask me. Rosalie understands. Rosalie wanted nothing more than a baby of her own. She would protect that baby with everything she has. And Emmett would support Rosalie. So even if Bella and Rosalie was not on the best of terms, Rosalie was the only one who could help her protect ehr baby.
Charlie...is kept in the dark. The fact that she was able to spend time with him after she changed, is not going to last IMO. Because he is going to notice that neither his daughter, his son-in-law or his grandchild is aging. So at one point, they are going to have to break contact with him, I think. So of course he is going to be hurt by that. But I still think it is right for Bella. She has to choose what is right for her.
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Re: Bella Swan Cullen #3

Postby Jazz Girl » Sun Jun 14, 2009 11:01 am

In honor of The Day of the Rings, the Cullenist celebration of the day Edward & Bella became engaged, I ask the following question:

Bella's reactions to both of Edward's proposals were fairly strong. Discuss all the reasons that might have played a part in her reaction. In the end, did she want to marry Edward, committ to him in all things, or not?
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Re: Bella Swan Cullen #3

Postby Dovrebanen » Sun Jun 14, 2009 2:50 pm

Jazz Girl wrote:In honor of The Day of the Rings, the Cullenist celebration of the day Edward & Bella became engaged, I ask the following question:

Bella's reactions to both of Edward's proposals were fairly strong. Discuss all the reasons that might have played a part in her reaction. In the end, did she want to marry Edward, committ to him in all things, or not?

Priestess, what an excellent idea!
The first time he asked her to marry him, I think she was very surprised. She had just been living without him for so long, and she had only just realized that he loved her. And she certainly was not expecting that to be his condition for changing her. But the reason she reacted so strongly, I think, is because she was very young. And she had seen what happened to her parents marriage. And I don't think she was afraid that the same would happen to her and Edward, but she was afraid what everyone else, and her mother in particular, would think of her. And she didn't see herself as the marrying kind, especially not straight out of high school. I think marriage had not even crossed her mind at that point. This does not mean that she wasn't sure of Edward or her future with him. I think it just had to do with the institution marriage, that she was not comfortable with.

The second time...He set marriage as a condition for making love to her. Her mind was very clouded at the time when she said yes. She was a bit confused, and she really wanted all of him. IMO she treated him horribly for a while there. Refusing to try on the ring, making it sound like she had just accepted to attend her own funeral. But in the end, during the actual proposal with Edward on his knees in front of her, I think a part of her really wanted it all. And not to forget, she really wanted to see him happy. And he was glowing.
For a while it seemed like she was doing it for everyone else. To make Renee, Charlie, Alice and Edward happy. Edward also realized this and gave her an option out. But by that time, I think she really wanted to marry him. For the sake of others, but also for herself. She wanted to be tied to him in every way, physically, legally and emotionally. And it really hit her when she was walking down the stairs on her wedding day, and saw him standing there. That was when she knew what she really wanted. So I would say at the time of the proposal she wasn't too sure about marriage, mostly because she didn't see it as her thing. But in the end, she really wanted to marry Edward IMO.
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Re: Bella Swan Cullen #3

Postby vampirenerd » Sun Jun 14, 2009 3:46 pm

First off I have to agree our priestess came up with an excellent question.

Trine, I also agree with pretty much everything you said. The first time he proposed was probably the first time she ever thought about marriage. Also, she didn't exactly have a good example to base her ideas about marriage on. She said no b/c she saw no reason to marry him. In her mind once she was a vamp they would be together forever so what was the point in marriage.

I also agree that the second time she agreed, at first, only b/c she wanted to make love to him. She had already said no to his proposition that she marry him and then he'd be the one to change her. She was willing to let Carlisle do it instead. But when he said no sex as a human unless you marry me she caved. I do believe also that her feelings eventually did change and she realized that marrying him was what she really wanted, not just b/c she would be getting something out of it.
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Re: Bella Swan Cullen #3

Postby The Dark Knight » Mon Jun 15, 2009 4:45 am

Dovrebanen wrote:
Jazz Girl wrote:In honor of The Day of the Rings, the Cullenist celebration of the day Edward & Bella became engaged, I ask the following question:

Bella's reactions to both of Edward's proposals were fairly strong. Discuss all the reasons that might have played a part in her reaction. In the end, did she want to marry Edward, committ to him in all things, or not?

Priestess, what an excellent idea!
The first time he asked her to marry him, I think she was very surprised. She had just been living without him for so long, and she had only just realized that he loved her. And she certainly was not expecting that to be his condition for changing her. But the reason she reacted so strongly, I think, is because she was very young. And she had seen what happened to her parents marriage. And I don't think she was afraid that the same would happen to her and Edward, but she was afraid what everyone else, and her mother in particular, would think of her. And she didn't see herself as the marrying kind, especially not straight out of high school. I think marriage had not even crossed her mind at that point. This does not mean that she wasn't sure of Edward or her future with him. I think it just had to do with the institution marriage, that she was not comfortable with.

The second time...He set marriage as a condition for making love to her. Her mind was very clouded at the time when she said yes. She was a bit confused, and she really wanted all of him. IMO she treated him horribly for a while there. Refusing to try on the ring, making it sound like she had just accepted to attend her own funeral. But in the end, during the actual proposal with Edward on his knees in front of her, I think a part of her really wanted it all. And not to forget, she really wanted to see him happy. And he was glowing.
For a while it seemed like she was doing it for everyone else. To make Renee, Charlie, Alice and Edward happy. Edward also realized this and gave her an option out. But by that time, I think she really wanted to marry him. For the sake of others, but also for herself. She wanted to be tied to him in every way, physically, legally and emotionally. And it really hit her when she was walking down the stairs on her wedding day, and saw him standing there. That was when she knew what she really wanted. So I would say at the time of the proposal she wasn't too sure about marriage, mostly because she didn't see it as her thing. But in the end, she really wanted to marry Edward IMO.


Can't add to much to this one as it's already in there Dovrebanen. I will only add that she was still not sure that she was worthy of her sefl proclaimed god. :shock:
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Re: Bella Swan Cullen #3

Postby Angelvamp » Mon Jun 15, 2009 10:20 am

I completely agree with Dark Knight, not much else to add there, Dovrebanen! And that Bella never thought she was worthy of Edward, or even that he loved her as much as she loved him, until the end of EC.

But I think that it was out of character for Bella to be so concerned with what everyone else thought. She never did before, why now? I mean, she's willing to die for her VAMPIRE sweetie for goodness sake, and she's worried about MARRIAGE? Just seems weird, but I guess that's Bella!
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Re: Bella Swan Cullen #3

Postby Jazz Girl » Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:03 pm

Thank you all for the kudos and for the excellent responses. I too agree that Dovrebanen essentially summed it all up.

But, for the sake of argument, I would add this. When Edward falls to his knee and begs Bella's hand in Eclipse, Bella says she had a number of responses, some of which would seem snarky and some of which were too girly and over the top to actually be said out loud. But, I will get to that in a minute.

Bella's reaction to the first proposal in New Moon was completely understandable to me, even though I do have to resist the urge to climb on to the page and shake her sometimes. Edward's proposal, while genuine, could easily be perceived as a reaction to the threat of their relationship ending, her not taking him back because of his own massive stupidity. As a woman in love, not necessarily the ideal circumstances for a proposal. I think, while she wants to know that Edward is telling the truth, that he will never again leave her side willingly, add the idea that he might be proposing out of guilt or fear to her already monumental fears about marriage. The result you get is her very understandable, if not a little harsh, reaction.

As for the second proposal, the absolutely heart-wrenchingly beautiful moment when Edward completely lays himself open to her and she pretty much does a Mexican Hat Dance all over his heart. Well, I have just a few feelings about that one. :D I still get Bella's reaction. I do. As a child of divorce who grew up in a time where marriage is less of a committment than buying a new car, it is hard to understand a point of view where marriage is the ultimate sign of committment, especially when compared to giving up your mortality. But, at the same time, the man you claim to love literally more than life itself has just asked you to do nothing more than say a few words in front of someone official. He didn't ask for Elvis impersonators and skydiving. He didn't ask for a poofy ballgown and 27 bridesmaids with releasing doves and an 108 piece orchestra. He asked to marry her in some form, any form, so long as it was legally binding. Seriously, would it be that bloody hard to see in his eyes how much it means to him and to at least cede gracefully.

That being said, I do wonder what those too girly things running through her head were? I am willing to bet next week's paycheck that Edward wouldn't have minded one of those reactions one little bit.
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Re: Bella Swan Cullen #3

Postby The Dark Knight » Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:37 am

it sure would have been nice to know what those tow things where...maybe just maybe when they do Breaking Dawn and Bella finds a way to let her guard down so Edward can see her mind those two things will be revealed...here to hoping for them...

By the way can Bella be anymore thoughtless toward Edwards feeeling here????
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Re: Bella Swan Cullen #3

Postby Jazz Girl » Tue Jun 16, 2009 5:48 pm

The Dark Knight wrote:it sure would have been nice to know what those tow things where...maybe just maybe when they do Breaking Dawn and Bella finds a way to let her guard down so Edward can see her mind those two things will be revealed...here to hoping for them...

By the way can Bella be anymore thoughtless toward Edwards feeeling here????


In a word: NO
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Re: Bella Swan Cullen #3

Postby The Dark Knight » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:48 am

So why is bella so relatible to people? Why are they compelled to read these books? What about her makes us want to see just around the bend?
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