True Love? Reality or Myth

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Re: True Love? Reality or Myth

Postby The Dark Knight » Fri Aug 07, 2009 11:06 am

Angelvamp wrote:
The Dark Knight wrote:Here's one point of view, from a guy even, the pursuits of "true love" is only possible when leisure time is available. So, only those cultures advanced enough to produce more than there needs are can even attempt such discussion. That coupled with ideals that started in the late middle ages of chivalry and courtly love we start to have poets and troubadours that get people thinking about True Love.

This leads to the age of enlightenment where education and knowledge is spread widely. It starts people wondering about their love interest. During this time arranged marriages are still common and divorce is unheard of. So how do they find true love? They write about it and dream about it till the cultures they live in change their views. This basically takes till the Victorian Era to occur. Yes it occurs on occasion but by in large marriage is a business contract and little to do with love. There the revival of the Chivalry and Courtly love is transformed into the modern view we have today. True love is available if you can just find that person.

Now for Soul mates, all love has in it the seeds of tragedy. It’s one of the panicles of virtues that we strive for but often fall short on. The concept of having your other half born near enough to you so that you can find them is hard to fathom. That does not mean it can’t happen just not likely. Who knows you might get another chance next time…


Wow! A true love discussion with a guy even! We here on the Lex are fortunate. :mrgreen:

I'm not so sure about advanced cultures having a monopoly on true love. The legends of the Quiluetes talk about the Third Wife and Native Americans are thought to have a similar culture to ancient man. And it is suspected that even hunter-gatherers had more free time than we modern people do.

You're probably right about the Victorian era as being the start of our modern idea of true love. I'm not sure that marriage and true love were mutually inclusive though, especially in the times of arranged marriages.

I love that, "All love has in it the seeds of tragedy." Is that a quote or all yours? It's really rather lovely. And, of course, true. I think that's one of the reasons why Bella's and Edward's tale of true love is so compelling.



Not sure If it's something I read/heard or what but it flowed right on the page this morning...sometimes I even shock myself at what flows out or me...hummmm, that doesn't sound right...oh well
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Re: True Love? Reality or Myth

Postby opulent » Tue Aug 11, 2009 3:08 am

I have absolutely got to jump in here. I pride myself on being a realist, but in this case, I gotta say, true love does exist.

Now, that begs the question, what does everyone here consider true love? Is it an all-consuming, irrational thing like what Bella and Edward have? Is it a simple compatibility and nothing more? By the way, I had better put a disclaimer in here: I am not in love, nor have I ever been.

But I have observed my parents, two brothers, and one sister all fall in love. To be around my parents, there is no denying that they have the real thing. So I feel pretty comfortable saying that I know what it is and that it does exist. And did I mention that my parents have been very happily married for thirty three and a half years?

It is absolutely blind - at first. There is a warm and fuzzy feeling, like being a little tipsy, according to my siblings. But, that slows down into something more natural after the first few years. Easy as breathing, like Bella said about Jake. Both people in the relationship see each others' faults, but are willing to overlook them because they see so much more than that. There is still a deep love there, a shared desire for each other to know everything about one another, and to rarely be apart for too long. My parents argue, sure, but I have never seen them angry at one another for more than an hour.

And, at even 58 and 51 years of age, my parents still have a spark between them. My dad thinks my mom is the most beautiful person in the world, and she thinks he is the most intelligent. They aren't, either of them, but that, I think, is what their love did for them. I asked my mom once what made her marry my dad, and she replied that she was "looking for a man that could love her with all his heart, and vice versa. And I did." Awwww. . . . :P

I don't however, think that love like Bella and Edward's exists. It is too much for humans - SM even implies in the book that this is a supernatural love. It wouldn't allow them to lead their individual lives outside of one another. For those who are very devout religiously, they wouldn't really have time for God anymore if they shared a love like that with someone. For those who are big family people like I am, it would be more difficult for them to make the choice that Bella did and really leave their family behind. I just don't think that this kind of love is possible for humans. I think that something more along the lines of Bella and Jake's kind of love exists.
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Re: True Love? Reality or Myth

Postby The Dark Knight » Tue Aug 11, 2009 3:44 am

opulent wrote:I have absolutely got to jump in here. I pride myself on being a realist, but in this case, I gotta say, true love does exist.

Now, that begs the question, what does everyone here consider true love? Is it an all-consuming, irrational thing like what Bella and Edward have? Is it a simple compatibility and nothing more? By the way, I had better put a disclaimer in here: I am not in love, nor have I ever been.

But I have observed my parents, two brothers, and one sister all fall in love. To be around my parents, there is no denying that they have the real thing. So I feel pretty comfortable saying that I know what it is and that it does exist. And did I mention that my parents have been very happily married for thirty three and a half years?

It is absolutely blind - at first. There is a warm and fuzzy feeling, like being a little tipsy, according to my siblings. But, that slows down into something more natural after the first few years. Easy as breathing, like Bella said about Jake. Both people in the relationship see each others' faults, but are willing to overlook them because they see so much more than that. There is still a deep love there, a shared desire for each other to know everything about one another, and to rarely be apart for too long. My parents argue, sure, but I have never seen them angry at one another for more than an hour.

And, at even 58 and 51 years of age, my parents still have a spark between them. My dad thinks my mom is the most beautiful person in the world, and she thinks he is the most intelligent. They aren't, either of them, but that, I think, is what their love did for them. I asked my mom once what made her marry my dad, and she replied that she was "looking for a man that could love her with all his heart, and vice versa. And I did." Awwww. . . . :P

I don't however, think that love like Bella and Edward's exists. It is too much for humans - SM even implies in the book that this is a supernatural love. It wouldn't allow them to lead their individual lives outside of one another. For those who are very devout religiously, they wouldn't really have time for God anymore if they shared a love like that with someone. For those who are big family people like I am, it would be more difficult for them to make the choice that Bella did and really leave their family behind. I just don't think that this kind of love is possible for humans. I think that something more along the lines of Bella and Jake's kind of love exists.


Well, here's my take, true love is what one thinks it is. I have heard too many definitions of it to really feel comfortable to say one is right over the others. That being said, I also postulate that True Love comes in an infinite number of flavors to satisfy the demand. Just a view I have held for a while...
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Re: True Love? Reality or Myth

Postby haniix--c-- » Tue Aug 11, 2009 6:47 pm

iv been thinking about this for a while and this applies more to general loe rather than "true love" but it seems the only way to make us (us being humankind) feel that we need to protect or look after someone and that if they hurt then we hurt but thats the thing is the only way we can care about someone if it would pain ourselves to pain them are we so selfish that we need that incentive to care or is it because we care that we have the incentive its a bit like the chicken and the egg. Which came first?
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Re: True Love? Reality or Myth

Postby opulent » Wed Aug 12, 2009 1:42 am

The Dark Knight wrote:Well, here's my take, true love is what one thinks it is. I have heard too many definitions of it to really feel comfortable to say one is right over the others. That being said, I also postulate that True Love comes in an infinite number of flavors to satisfy the demand. Just a view I have held for a while...


I have to agree with you DK. I think that love becomes whatever each person needs it to be. For someone who grew up without a mother, maybe their true love would take on a more maternal role. For one who didn't have any friends growing up, their love would be their best friend (although I rather hope that in any case of love, everyone's true love would be their best friend. . .)
I do think, however, that true love should make people feel whole, maybe even content with life. It should make them feel wanted, like they matter in the scheme of things.
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Re: True Love? Reality or Myth

Postby The Dark Knight » Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:25 am

opulent wrote:
The Dark Knight wrote:Well, here's my take, true love is what one thinks it is. I have heard too many definitions of it to really feel comfortable to say one is right over the others. That being said, I also postulate that True Love comes in an infinite number of flavors to satisfy the demand. Just a view I have held for a while...


I have to agree with you DK. I think that love becomes whatever each person needs it to be. For someone who grew up without a mother, maybe their true love would take on a more maternal role. For one who didn't have any friends growing up, their love would be their best friend (although I rather hope that in any case of love, everyone's true love would be their best friend. . .)
I do think, however, that true love should make people feel whole, maybe even content with life. It should make them feel wanted, like they matter in the scheme of things.


I heard something tonight on "In plain sight." This is a male POV, after the main female character is shot her Boy friend and partner are talking in the lobby. It went something like this. BF "I normally a violent man but." P "Yah I understand, your inner need to protect you love ones make you want to savage anything that threatens it." I no it's not an exact quote but close enough...

Any thoughts?
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Re: True Love? Reality or Myth

Postby opulent » Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:49 am

Oh definitely I agree.. .
My dad is a good dad, and he loves his kids, but good example here:
My brother didn't mean to knock my mom down while he was riding his bike. He was only around 13 years old, but he plowed straight into my mom on accident. My dad was beyond furious. He grabbed my brother by the ear and yelled at him for a half hour.

Now I am sure that this isn't exactly what you had in mind by "threatening a loved one" DK, but it is still close. I think that people really do get upset when their chosen life and love is threatened, whether intentionally or not. I do think that protectiveness is usually stronger in men than women. I remember hearing once that women are not allowed in active combat in the military because the men around them are sometimes overtaken by the instinct to protect the woman, and end up costing them whatever mission they are on.

By the way, just out of curiosity, DK, are you a night owl, or are you just somewhere in the world where it is a reasonable time of the day and not two or three in the morning?
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Re: True Love? Reality or Myth

Postby The Dark Knight » Wed Aug 12, 2009 3:50 am

opulent wrote:Oh definitely I agree.. .
My dad is a good dad, and he loves his kids, but good example here:
My brother didn't mean to knock my mom down while he was riding his bike. He was only around 13 years old, but he plowed straight into my mom on accident. My dad was beyond furious. He grabbed my brother by the ear and yelled at him for a half hour.

Now I am sure that this isn't exactly what you had in mind by "threatening a loved one" DK, but it is still close. I think that people really do get upset when their chosen life and love is threatened, whether intentionally or not. I do think that protectiveness is usually stronger in men than women. I remember hearing once that women are not allowed in active combat in the military because the men around them are sometimes overtaken by the instinct to protect the woman, and end up costing them whatever mission they are on.

By the way, just out of curiosity, DK, are you a night owl, or are you just somewhere in the world where it is a reasonable time of the day and not two or three in the morning?


I work nights. The military issue with women in combat is strictly a western European view and their descendants. The rest of the cultures do not have that issue. It’s born out the “courtly love” view point and does in fact happen. Your example is just fine as it illustrated how things are. There is a primitive reactions still engrained in most men to protect the hearth and home which is easily tapped in times of stress.

Now here’s where I have seen women get their inner “Kitty has Claws” on. When one lady tries to sable up to another women’s man; talk about territoriality in action.

I work nights. The military issue with women in combat is strickly a western Eurpeon view and their decendants. the rest of the
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Re: True Love? Reality or Myth

Postby gamb1t » Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:40 pm

Sorry guys and gals, I have been really busy over the last few months and have fallen behind with a lot of my forum discussions. I just now read through everything I had missed and I am awestruck that people have started posting under this topic again with very, very good discussion points.

opulent wrote:I do think, however, that true love should make people feel whole, maybe even content with life. It should make them feel wanted, like they matter in the scheme of things.


This was very well stated Opulent :). I couldn't agree more.

So here's a question just to stir up some conversation. Are we born with one set true love, or is true love something we have to make for ourselves instead of just finding? For example, if someone falls in love with/marries someone, things don't work out, and end up marrying someone else, does this mean that the first person wasn't their true love because things didn't work out in marriage? Furthermore, can someone have more than one true love when it comes to people, or is it something that must be singular?
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Re: True Love? Reality or Myth

Postby Asheleyo » Tue Aug 18, 2009 9:05 pm

Ok, my perspective is biased because of my personal experiences. I feel that one is certainly capable of finding true love more than once. It depends on where they are in life and location as to whether they find it or realize it. Like we've said multiple times, relationships have to be worked on, but I don't think true love is something you can force just by trying to make it work. If it's not there, no manner of effort will make it all snap together.

Personally, I have felt two true loves in my life. I categorize them this way: the first was my passionate, more physical true love and the second was my intellectual and emotional true love. The first was intense but unstable and the second is everything I wanted in a relationship. I don't think love comes in one form for any particular person. Every relationship is different, and some loves will endure even if the relationship can't.
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