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Re: Jacob Black #2

Postby Vampibella » Tue Dec 22, 2009 3:07 pm

Hey ! I have an important question! Does Jacob speak indian in the scene where he stands with bella in the kitchen trying to kiss her, but Edward interrupts them with his phonecalling? I really need to know! :) :D
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Re: Jacob Black #2

Postby Jazz Girl » Wed Dec 23, 2009 2:25 am

Yes. In EW last week, it is one of the easter eggs they talked about. Unfortunately, they didn't translate what he says. They gave a link to the Quileute Nation website to ask for the answer. But, according to another source, he says, "Stay with me forever" or something to that effect.
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Re: Jacob Black #2

Postby alphanubilus » Wed Jan 06, 2010 3:28 pm

Alright, I am finally going to shed my thoughts on my favorit character in the Twilight universe... If people hadn't guessed already that it was going to be Jacob, all they have to do is look at my avatar. No... it isn't Jacob, and YES I did draw it, but it does serve its purposes.

For a character that was never planned to be a huge part of the original Twilight world, Jacob Black actually evolved into one of the most sophisticated characters in the entire story. Much of the other cast of characters already had their character archs long before the Twilight story began.

But here we have Jacob Black...

Jacob is an interesting character because he evolves through out the course of the story, and in many ways the Twilight Saga becomes just as much his story as it does the others.

There are a few life factors that ultimately define Jacob's desire and over all need of Bella.

The death of his mother...

The abandoning of his sisters...

Every female in Jacob's life has either passed away, or in the case of his sisters, left him. They couldn't bear to be in the same house that their mother had lived in, so they left. This left a deep hole in Jacob's life.

Coming from a broken family, I know how he would have felt. You want what you don't have.

We start the story with "Twilight" Jacob.

When Jacob first meets Bella, while she doesn't remember him, he faintly remembers her, as they were friends when they were really little. Once Jacob reintroduces himself, he's already trying to make an unspoken claim on her, or at least one that gives him more rights to her than, let's say, Mike. A. He already knows her. B. Her dad and his dad are best friends, and C. He has something she wants...ergo info on the Cullens. He uses this information to boost his stature, of which helps him make up for the age difference.

The greater question is, why did Jacob take a special interest in Bella, as opposed to girls on the Rez? Well, Steph never really addresses that, but the truth is, my theory is that Bella was simply different. I'm sure Jacob had native friends, but the idea of having a friendship with the "new" girl would be really cool. She's different than anybody else. She's a new and not so new face. Jacob immediately develops a crush on Bella. It doesn't help that Bella likes Jacob's friendship, but Jacob also realizes that there is only one "man" in Bella's life, and that is Edward.

Here comes New Moon Jacob...

Jacob is the loyal friend (oddly like man's best friend), who steps in, when Edward leaves. While he doesn't intend to start a relationship, one developes none the less. He wants to be Bella's best friend, but part of him, wants/needs something more. As stated, he's lost his mother... He doesn't see his sisters. Part of him desires a much more solid foundation than mere friendship, something more that he can claim and will not leave. Bella, unfortunately, is broken at this point, and despite her awareness to Jacob's needs, she can't bring herself to make that commitment, as she may not be able to be the girl that Jacob really needs. Even still though, she can't help but be drawn to Jacob, of which causes further conflict.

Jacob becomes a werewolf. While becoming a giant wolf at the slight provocation isn't bad enough, what truly kills Jacob, is the fact that he believes, he's lost all chances to be with Bella, not even as just a friend. He's incredibly guilty that he had to recant all the promises he gave her, and now Bella will be one more precious thing that is torn from him. His feelings are further complicated as he now has to share them with the entire pack. Another issue that arises in Jacob's conflicted feelings is that the reason of his transformation is the arrival of vampires in the area. The reason THEY came, was because of the Cullens. Bella's Edward IS a vampire. Jacob develops a deep rooted hatred, as he easily blames Edward and the rest of the Cullens for what has happened to him. He hates Edward even more, as he believes that Bella is lost to him forever as well. Add the fact that he is LITERALLY forced to do everything Sam tells him to, makes Jacob feel more like a puppet, even though he knows that Sam means well and is just looking out for their pack and La Push.

When Bella accepts him as a werewolf though, Jacob's world begins to move back on track. Bella doesn't freak at the idea of him being what he is, and in many ways, this resolidifies his claim on her. He is now her protector. He big brave russett wolf. Bella's barriers are weakening due to Jacob's constant devotion to her, even though his anti-Edward remarks are annoying. However the worse thing in Jacob's little world is about to happen...

Edward (BOO--HISS!) returns. :D

Not only does Edward return and Bella excepts him without question. Jacob learns that Bella WANTS to become a vampire. This breaks his warm and fuzzy heart -- ergo the sad puppy eyes as seen in the movie. I'm sure Jacob went home and cried himself to sleep. That would hurt.

Here comes... tada! Eclipse Jacob...

We begin the story with Jacob hurt and resentful. Not only has Bella' acceptance of Edward and her future as a vampire, shattered any hopes of his claim on her, it will also destroy their friendship, so he will lose her two fold, at least as he believes. Jacob is further hurt as he doesn't have really anything to offer Bella. He can't compare to Edward. His family is broken and extremely poor. As vampire hunting and protecting La Push begins to take priority, he's finding himself spending more and more time as a wolf. Unlike the rest of the pack, Jacob doesn't have a mom to come home to, a Kim, a Clair, an Emiley. Yeah, he has Billy, but there is that horrible hole of incompleteness that keeps digging him. Being a wolf though makes him feel better, but it IS the wolf thing, that also keeps him from her. Edward won't let Bella see him, as he is afraid that he will harm her. To Jacob, this would certainly be insulting, as it was harm from a vampire that nearly took her life, not once, but twice already, and that is not counting the near fatal accident with Jasper. When Bella finally breaks free from Edward, Jacob decides to give it all he has one last time. He tries to force Bella's draw per say. Show her his deck, and hopefully it will be enough to win the game. While Bella FINALLY acknowledges that she does love Jacob, her heart and soul belong to Edward. Through their encounter with the Cullens, the Pack for the most part begins to tolerate the Cullens more, and Seth actually develops a close friendship with Edward (way to go Seth!). Bella's final rejection of him as more than a friend though, is the final straw. He can't bear to think of her as anything but Bella and while he does give up his claim, the idea of her becoming one of them and thus he never seeing her agian, unless hunting her, is too much for him to bear. He becomes a wolf and leaves...

Breaking Dawn Jacob...

Jacob ran and ran, living as a wolf for months on end. He tried with every once of his being to remove all humanity from himself, but the reality is, despite everything that had happened, the second rate werewolf still needed Bella. Down deep, he knows that Edward will care for her, and because of his dealing with vampires, he knows that Bella, as one, will be powerful enough, but the idea of losing the chance to see her "alive" one last time, is just too tempting. Jacob turns tail and goes back home. He barely makes it in time for the wedding, but his moment of happiness is ruined when he finds out that Bella plans to copulate human.

Jacob's world seems to once agian be hanging on the hindges. He is so angry over everything that he's seeing red and wants a fight, whether a fight is needed or not, and folks it is here in Breaking Dawn that we see much of Jacob's evolution. In reality, Jacob goes through more changes than any other character in the entire series, and I'm not talking about the physical sense.

As the story progresses, despite the dire situation, Jacob's relationship with Bella continues to grow, and not just with Bella but the vampires as well. Carlisle leaves the greatest impression on him, while Esme's tenderness touches him, as it rekindles pleasant memories of his mother. In fact, once Jacob, removes the concept that they are vampires, he starts to see them as people. Of course, Jacob is still incomplete, and that is until Renesmee is born.

Love her or hate her, Renesmee is the key that closes the hole in Jacob's chest. She was, in essence, made for Jacob, as Jacob was for her. She is every as much apart of Bella and in fact she looks like Bella. Something else happens here though, something both unique and unexpected for our unhappy werewolf. With imprinting on Renesmee, Jacob finally has a legit claim on Bella an immortal one to boot. He not only gains a future wife, but a real mother. It is weird... I know, but it works. He also gains a father, with Edward. Edward, by the end of the story, not only accepts Jacob's eventually destiny and placement in the family, he also acknowledges his claim on Edward's daughter. He calls him his son.

By Edward achnowledging him as his son, is in essence giving Jacob rites to inheritence, however vampires handle that. Jacob's family will NEVER have to hurt for money, and I'm sure Alice will develop werewolf-safe cloths. For the first time in Jacob's life, he is complete.

As stated, Jacob Black has one of the most complex character archs in the entire saga, in so much, that Steph opted to alter her creative process and thus allow him to speak for a good portion of her last book. It makes me wonder, had she thought of Jacob's importance earlier on, if she had written Twilight as a werewolf romance novel, as opposed to a vampire? Sort of weird thinking of it like that... but hey.

Now onto my personal feelings about Jacob. I liked Jacob Black largely due to the fact that I felt so sorry for him. In many ways, he's the underdog (no pun intended) of the story. You want the poor guy to beat the rich guy. For a while in the story, it felt like I was watching Titanic, and Rose was choosing the rich guy over Dicaprio, so despite all the opposition and the fact that I KNEW what was going to happen, I REALLY wanted Jacob to win. In the end Edward is more deserving, but one couldn't help but feel for the little wuffer...

Then again...

I could be biased. :D

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Re: Jacob Black #2

Postby dazzledBrit » Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:04 am

Vampibella wrote:Hey ! I have an important question! Does Jacob speak indian in the scene where he stands with bella in the kitchen trying to kiss her, but Edward interrupts them with his phonecalling? I really need to know! :) :D


When Jacob says “kwopkalawo’li” (pronunced quo-p-kah-lah-WOH-oh-lee) to Bella, he is saying “I Love You” in Quileute.

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Re: Jacob Black #2

Postby The girlie-wolf » Sun Apr 04, 2010 11:32 am

OK... So Jacob is my fav. cahrecter in Twilight.....I love him so much...
I think that Nessie is not perfect for Jacob and I want more for him... but he is finally happy... after so long! so I don't care who he imprints on (though I hope it would be me :lol: )... I'm just thrilled that he is happy...

Jacob suffers for so long in Twilight... especially in Eclipse. He only wants to save Bella and hopes to win her heart. And instead, she hurt him over and over again. It's so hard for me to read, especially the scene in the end of Eclipse, in the ch. Ethics. I can't get this line out of my mind! "The clouds I can handle, but I can't fight ith an Eclipse"... this is my fav. line in the whole saga...
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Re: Jacob Black #2

Postby The girlie-wolf » Sun Apr 04, 2010 11:41 am

I have a theory about Jacob's behavior in Eclipse... why he acts like a jerk sometimes... like "sam's" Jacob

Jacob is using a mask in Eclipse. This mask covers the real Jacob... it makes him cynical and a jerk...Jacob is trying to protect himself from Bella.
I know that right now it sounds kinda stupid... and i'll try to explain better

Jacob is trying to protect himself from rejection (if you read ch.9 and 10, BD you'd know what i mean). He knows that Bella will reject him if he says anything and he know he wouldn't stand it, the pain will be too much for him to bare.As you know, he is trying to delud himself that Bella wants him too (like he says in Bella's graduation party, Eclipse, Ch. 17)So everytime he thinks he is going to show his true feeling, to "confess" to Bella (like when he says he is in love with her and she is kinda mean to him. Eclipse, Ch. 14 & 15), he stops himself. He don't want to get hurt...So he becomes the jerk that you all know in Eclipse.

Also, Edward is more mature (he is 109) and Jacob is fighting for her...the way his 16 years allow him...he just wants to make his point clear and snap Bella out of her obsession for Edward for a while just enough for her to realize that she loves him too...and she can stay with him and be happy and alive and have babies and stay with her family and enjoy a delicious barbecue ...You need to fight for who you love ..and if you see the whole picture..he is fighting for Bella's love with another man, but at the same time, he is fighting to keep his loved one alive...


I have a few exampls:

""What's the matter with you, Bella?" The joking bravado vanished from his face, reaviling my Jacob underneath, like pulling a mask away" (Eclipse. Ch, 21, Pg. 425)

"...You're my best friend. At least used to be, and still sometimes are.... when you let your gourd down" (Eclipse, Ch. 21, Pg. 426)

"He smiled the old smile I loved. "I'm always that.", He promised. "Evenwhen I don't..... behave as I should, Underneath, I'm always in here." (Eclipse, Ch. 21, Pg. 426)

I know it's all from the same chapter and the same pages but these are the best examples because he let his "gourd" down....And it keeps proving it self in BD... because he is not the same there...



This is what Stephenie says about the subject in her website:

"Jacob doesn't have a tragic flaw. He has one goal and one hope. His goal is to save Bella's life. His hope is that he'll win her heart in the process. He fails at both. But that doesn't mean he regrets trying. If he could do it over again, he'd do the same thing. Jacob couldn't live with himself if he didn't give saving Bella his best effort—he knows it's going to hurt when he loses, but he knows it would hurt worse if he didn't try. Does he do everything right? Heck, no! But he's sixteen and he's making it up as he goes along. Those who are upset by some of his tactics should consider his youth and the fact that he is, after all, right. Bella is in love with him. (In the end, it's truly healthier for her to be aware of this as she goes forward with unalterable decisions.)"
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Re: Jacob Black #2

Postby holdingoutforjacob » Sat Apr 10, 2010 6:19 pm

I LOVE that someone else sees that! I see it a little differently, granted, by I love that someone else sees that it's not Sam's Jacob that is a cynical jerk, it's not Sam that makes him that way, it's not being a wolf, it's being continually led on, rejected, and hurt by Bella!

I think his cynicism and hardness comes from the fact that he is throwing himself into a losing battle. He knows he's going to lose, he knows it's going to hurt, and he has to do it anyway. I don't know that he's so much protecting himself from Bella. I sort of see it as simply an outward reflection of the pain and drive that's going on inside him.

I was reading the Lex's personal correspondence with SM today, and stumbled across something interesting, from pre-Eclipse that she says about Jacob. She was discussing how people hated him so much in New Moon, and said this:

"If people can still hate Jacob after Eclipse, we'll see...."

I was surprised to see this, because so many people will say they liked Jacob in New Moon but not in Eclipse, while I, personally, completely fell for him in Eclipse as opposed to New Moon. I thought it was because I fell so out of love with Edward after various bits of Eclipse, but this definitely makes me feel less weird!
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Re: Jacob Black #2

Postby The girlie-wolf » Sun Apr 11, 2010 6:30 am

I guess that being a wolf was frustrating.. of course it was... in NM especially... But in Eclipse he already got over it so it can't be the fact that he is being a wolf..And Sam's Jacob is the wolf Jacob... it's just that Bella didn't know about it when she thought about the Sam thingy...
I guess you are right... But whatever it is... It's because of Bella and Edward... but like MS said, no matter how much he is frustrated and he knows he is going to lose, he will try to save her.. because he thinks that being a vamp is the worse thing there is... and he will always be there and will try to save her till her heart stops beating...

Yeah... I read it too a few days ago... and I was really in shock... first of all, I can't see why anyone will hate Jacob in NM... he was the perfect friend...But in Eclipse I get it.. I guess SM thought that everyone will look at it from her pov... because she thinks what we think :D
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Re: Jacob Black #2

Postby Jazz Girl » Sun Apr 11, 2010 4:21 pm

Merely as an ambassador of explanation, speaking for myself and many others who did come to dislike Jacob after Eclipse, it is primarily because he uses emotional manipulation to put himself in the middle of a decision in which he really has no place.
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Re: Jacob Black #2

Postby The girlie-wolf » Mon Apr 12, 2010 2:54 pm

I don't agree.. he is in love with Bella.. she's his whole life... and she is going to become the thing that he hates the most... the worst thing that can be like he sees it...
If the love of your life wanted to die, let's use this word couse vamp don't really exist :( , you won't try to convince him, in every way possible, to save him?
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