Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Discussion of the Twilight Saga: Breaking Dawn 1

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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Postby andypalmer » Mon May 03, 2010 5:34 pm

Biggest worry: pulling off Renesmee in a believable way

I'm totally ok with doing a fade to black for their first night - I think it will even help, cinimatically, to sow the confusion that Bella feels upon waking up and sensing Edward's tension. I am a bit concerned about how they'll handle her viewing of the bruising while retaining the rating.

For those of you dying to see some major snogging, I think their second time, after Bella wakes up mid-dream, would be more appropriate and could still be done PG-13.

For the birth, there are dozens of ways to do it and keep PG-13; I'm not even worried.

I am interested to see the special effects for Bella and Alec's powers. Even if Bella's shield can only be viewed by her, they could show it by changing perspectives.

What I don't want is the finale to turn into a big fight scene - just think about it. The Voluturi offensive powers are completely neutralized by Bella while those of the Amazonians and Egyptians are not - fighting blind when they're used to having total superiority will result in the Volturi getting slaughtered. Yeah, a few of the allied vampires might go down, but I doubt if the Volturi would have time to flame them. Some wolves would undoubtedly go down. But, what would that mean? Cullens are safe forever and everything is happy? No - remember, the only thing that has kept vampire-kind out of the public eye has been the policing by the Volturi; without them, the Cullens and every other vampire, would be hunted down and destroyed within 5-10 years...by us humans. So yes, I want the book finish...I want tension, I want suspense, I want to think, to feel, that a fight is imminent; I want to feel relief when it doesn't happen.
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Postby GrayceM » Mon May 03, 2010 5:45 pm

RebeccaCullen wrote:
Just because Jake will explain the imprinting in the movie like he did in the book, doesn't mean everyone will buy it that way. I didn't buy it as innocent in the book, and I sure won't buy it as innocent on the big screen.

Some people see things black and white, and one of those things does involve what the imprint concept implies - a forced relationship [at least, that's my impression of it because the concept was never fully laid out in the canon], and in regards with Renesmee and Jacob imprint, pedophilia.


I'm an avid reader and I have never noticed an author implying anything...especially when they are explaining something to the reader. It's your choice to read more into what's written...to see something sinister with the explaination that was given...
Maybe it wouldn't have seemed like this to readers if Stephanie had not explained it using Sam and Emily to begin with. If she had used the explaination that Jacob uses and his response about the imprintee's opinion first and then told of Emily and Sam, maybe everyone would think the relationship between them was weird...
/shrug. They are mythical, fictional characters, in a fictional world. I guess I tend to look at how Stephanie wrote almost everything as PG-13, or for teens. A little romance, not porn and choose to think that there wasn't anything evil in this story except for the murders. That's just how I see it though...
I could be wrong and that there's some underlying message in the story as a whole and I should go back and read them for what Stephanie could have meant in regards to a lot of situations...I'm not going to go back and read them again looking for hidden meanings in the teenage world. If it's not written, for me, it's not part of the story.
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Postby Jazz Girl » Mon May 03, 2010 5:50 pm

andypalmer wrote:I'm totally ok with doing a fade to black for their first night - I think it will even help, cinimatically, to sow the confusion that Bella feels upon waking up and sensing Edward's tension. I am a bit concerned about how they'll handle her viewing of the bruising while retaining the rating.



This is actually a reason why I would fully support a fuller love scene for that first night. In my opinion, it might help to counter the continued idiocy on the anti boards and even within the fandom about Edward being abusive to Bella. This is the second of two major pieces that they point to over and over and over and over ad nauseum to bolster that argument. A full love scene could show without argument the love and the devotion and the control that he shows during that whole night and counter every closeminded arsehat who's ever said that reason for the fade-to-black is because he does lose it and hurt her and she covers it up. I've accepted that, particularly with SM as a producer, that's probably not going to happen. But, it would be really nice to have.
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Postby RebeccaCullen » Mon May 03, 2010 6:12 pm

GrayceM wrote:I'm an avid reader and I have never noticed an author implying anything...especially when they are explaining something to the reader. It's your choice to read more into what's written...to see something sinister with the explaination that was given...
Maybe it wouldn't have seemed like this to readers if Stephanie had not explained it using Sam and Emily to begin with. If she had used the explaination that Jacob uses and his response about the imprintee's opinion first and then told of Emily and Sam, maybe everyone would think the relationship between them was weird...
/shrug. They are mythical, fictional characters, in a fictional world. I guess I tend to look at how Stephanie wrote almost everything as PG-13, or for teens. A little romance, not porn and choose to think that there wasn't anything evil in this story except for the murders. That's just how I see it though...
I could be wrong and that there's some underlying message in the story as a whole and I should go back and read them for what Stephanie could have meant in regards to a lot of situations...I'm not going to go back and read them again looking for hidden meanings in the teenage world. If it's not written, for me, it's not part of the story.


Like I said, the impression I walked away with from the series regarding the imprinting was that the relationship was pretty much forced. I mean, who wouldn't want someone at the beck and call, and you know would be faithful?
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Postby andypalmer » Mon May 03, 2010 6:20 pm

Jazz Girl wrote:This is actually a reason why I would fully support a fuller love scene for that first night. In my opinion, it might help to counter the continued idiocy on the anti boards and even within the fandom about Edward being abusive to Bella. This is the second of two major pieces that they point to over and over and over and over ad nauseum to bolster that argument. A full love scene could show without argument the love and the devotion and the control that he shows during that whole night and counter every closeminded arsehat who's ever said that reason for the fade-to-black is because he does lose it and hurt her and she covers it up. I've accepted that, particularly with SM as a producer, that's probably not going to happen. But, it would be really nice to have.

I get that, from the perspective of quieting those who simply don't get it, but then how could you maintain Bella's confusion, her "blissed to pissed" in under 6 seconds? I'd rather they took the time in their second scene to show Edward making the extra effort, moving his hand from her arm to the headboard, for example than to even try to capture that first time. Afterall, no matter how well they tried to do it, there'd be far more complaints that the scene didn't do it justice than even the current cries of those who don't get what the combination of "1000 times stronger than a human" and "first time" will mean, even with the the best of intentions and the most superhuman of self-control.
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Postby andypalmer » Mon May 03, 2010 6:26 pm

RebeccaCullen wrote:Like I said, the impression I walked away with from the series regarding the imprinting was that the relationship was pretty much forced. I mean, who wouldn't want someone at the beck and call, and you know would be faithful?

Well, if you call that forced, then I guess it is. The "imprinter" has no choice, the "magic" of the imprinting takes away any free agency in the matter. For the "imprintee" however, they still have their full choice. That's tempered, however, by the fact that the "imprinter" has become everything you would want and need at that point in your life. I mean, if you're a chocolate lover and there's a case of gourmet chocolate at your feet, how inclined are you to go hunting for other chocolate?

Thing is, too, if one of the "imprintees" did want to date someone else, the "imprinter" would let her; that type of self-sacrifice would be part of the "magic". That said, if I was dating one of those girls as the "other guy", I'd better make sure I was the perfect gentleman :-)
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Postby roseaurora » Mon May 03, 2010 6:31 pm

GrayceM wrote:I read the books again recently because I found there were several details I had forgotten since last year. For those of you worried about the imprinting or those who have misunderstood the imprinting as Stephanie meant it to be(I think)...there is a part in Eclipse for the specific purpose of explaining it.


It really doesn't matter how well it is understood in the book... reading about it and seeing it on the big screen are totally different.

Have you seen The Time Traveler's Wife or read the book... its the perfect example of this. I didn't think twice about the situation in the book until I saw the movie and was like "whoa! That's kind of creepy". And although I understand the imprinting as its used in the Twilight universe, it even made me think twice when reading it, so I think its definitely something to be worried about for the movie... (among many many other things...)
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Postby TammyAZ » Mon May 03, 2010 6:36 pm

I guess I just didn't read that much into the imprinting myself. When I think of imprinting in the animal world, and let's face it we're talking about wolves, I think of baby ducks following the first "grown up " thing they see no matter what species, and the mother dog who finds herself attached to a litter of kittens. I'm sure that is where SM got the idea of imprinting and I would like to think that that is what she had in mind when she wrote it.
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Postby roseaurora » Mon May 03, 2010 7:06 pm

TammyAZ wrote:I guess I just didn't read that much into the imprinting myself. When I think of imprinting in the animal world, and let's face it we're talking about wolves, I think of baby ducks following the first "grown up " thing they see no matter what species, and the mother dog who finds herself attached to a litter of kittens. I'm sure that is where SM got the idea of imprinting and I would like to think that that is what she had in mind when she wrote it.


I totally agree with you and won't be surprised if that is where she got it from. But the first couple the reader is introduced to as an imprinted pair are Emily and Sam, 2 adults. Then we learn of Claire and Quil (is that right...lol... been awhile) and its kind of interesting.... and then a new born infant and an adult male are paired. Its totally natural to find that a little disturbing whether the idea exists in nature or not. Even Edward had an issue with it :D
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Postby GrayceM » Mon May 03, 2010 7:42 pm

roseaurora wrote:I totally agree with you and won't be surprised if that is where she got it from. But the first couple the reader is introduced to as an imprinted pair are Emily and Sam, 2 adults. Then we learn of Claire and Quil (is that right...lol... been awhile) and its kind of interesting.... and then a new born infant and an adult male are paired. Its totally natural to find that a little disturbing whether the idea exists in nature or not. Even Edward had an issue with it :D



This is what I meant...I had heard of imprinting before this and so I thought it was strange when I read that Emily and Sam had imprinted. Until Jacob's explaination to Bella, it didn't make sense. I didn't know how Stephanie wanted readers to understand her usage of imprinting. I have not seen The Time Traveler's Wife but I have read some about it. I think the issues are coming up because people are seeing two adults in a relationship and then putting a child or a baby in the place of one of the adults. That didn't happen in this book. You will not see Claire or Renesmee as adults, so all we should see are Quil and Jacob being the best big brothers ever. I refuse to read something sinister into the relationship. Maybe Stephanie should have explained it before introducing us to Sam and Emily, but if you remember, they all thought the imprint thing was just a legend. I prefer to see the relationship how it was meant to be...as it was written by the author.
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