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Re: Jasper Hale

Postby Amethyst1 » Sat Oct 18, 2008 1:29 pm

hm, but are the unicorns and dinosaurs analogy apparent in the twilight series? i don't think so.
IT does make sense. because the vampires are based of their human self and woven in with extraordinary qualities. not everything has to be rational and possible. fantasy is an illogical aspect of fiction, it's laws and rules are made up and they're not rules created to make sense in our world. it makes sense in the twilight world.
okay, i'll head over to the twilight science thread sometime.

So what? if he hates school and thinks the kids are superficial teenagers.
it makes him and the other cullens more relatable. i sometimes HATE school, and i have internal thoughts about the kids at my school too because my thoughts are true. some of them are arses. the real deal.

they're not putting the kids at risk. all of the cullen's are compeletly capable of interacting with humans and being near them. even my dear jasper. with jasper, it's not that he doesn't have self-control, he doesn't think much of the humans. he'd killed so much of them before, it's hard to form a different idea on something than you're used to so most of the time his mind wanders about how delicious that blood circulating through the girls vein's is. and how good it would taste against his pale tongue, and giving him a full appetite. it's nothing personal, just a natural food source he's GIVEN UP!!
If he doesn't go to school and stays all day stuck in his house and go hunting every week or so. how WILL he ever learn to perfect his self-control? nothing like carlisle. but his self-restraint can weaken with time. don't you think?
it's the same with carlisle. if he stays from the hospital, lets say, he stays a year from there. don't you think, it will be REALLY hard for him when he comes back?
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Re: Jasper Hale

Postby Amivera » Sat Oct 18, 2008 2:32 pm

I think you missed my point when I said Jasper shouldn't go to school, because he doesn't like the people there. I didn't mean he HAD to like them. I was just saying that if he had no reason to be at school, why go there?

And I know he needs to perfect his self control, but to do it around innocent teenagers and risk their lives in the process, is a very selfish thing.

If he went and perfect his self control at a bar with a bunch of large, drunken men, then fine. If he did it at a whorehouse, fine. If he's doing it where kids are going to school, then no. Don't risk the lives of the children.
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Re: Jasper Hale

Postby pubesy » Sat Oct 18, 2008 6:32 pm

Talking about twilight and vampires as a "science" makes me laugh. The characters defy the laws of science in so many ways. Matter simply disappears (a BIG no no in science), There is no essential respiration, no elimination, and no other qualities that are essential to define an organism as living. But who cares? The story is fiction. Fiction does not always have to make sense. It just has to be entertaining!

S.Meyer's Vampires are about as scientific as the theory of intelligent design. Just because you believe something is true/untrue does not make it a SCIENCE.

Think about Dreamtime stories from Australian Aboriginals - that explain the creation of the world. A giant rainbow serpent shaped the rivers and mountains with his body? while this may not seem believable to some, it IS believed by many, and any plot holes are explained away using a bit of logic.
I am sure there are many cultural stories that do this.

Jasper was never really in any danger of killing a human at school. Not with Edward reading his mind and Alice predicting the future. As well as Emmett to catch him if ever he tried to hunt.

EVERY fictional story has it's flaws and plot holes. But that does not make the story, flawed, or unbelievable. It is up to the READER to ignore them, (or not even see them in the first place), or explain them away, using a bit of fantasy. It is up to the READERS imagination.
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Re: Jasper Hale

Postby Amivera » Sat Oct 18, 2008 7:23 pm

The science would best be discussed in the actual science thread over at the Quench Your Thirst subforum.
So I'll reply there.

I disagree with you on that Edward would be reading Jasper's mind, because he's not always in the same classes as him, and Jasper would move so quickly that Edward would never have a chance to get to him. Alice couldn't have a vision of the papercut, and neither Rosalie nor Emmett would be fast enough to protect the human and/or keep the students from finding out their secret if Jasper suddenly lunged across the room.

But I doubt we'll see eye-to-eye on this, so we can agree to disagree?
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Re: Jasper Hale

Postby sachael » Sun Oct 19, 2008 11:50 am

i like edward but i love jasper.. :D he can control emotions but unable to control his.. :) and besides edward already has lots of fans (and neck ready to be bitten ;) ) so i'll go with the cute vampire whose still struggling as i am right now (makes sense? i dunno hahah lol!)
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Re: Jasper Hale

Postby Amethyst1 » Sun Oct 19, 2008 3:45 pm

Amivera wrote:I think you missed my point when I said Jasper shouldn't go to school, because he doesn't like the people there. I didn't mean he HAD to like them. I was just saying that if he had no reason to be at school, why go there?

And I know he needs to perfect his self control, but to do it around innocent teenagers and risk their lives in the process, is a very selfish thing.

If he went and perfect his self control at a bar with a bunch of large, drunken men, then fine. If he did it at a whorehouse, fine. If he's doing it where kids are going to school, then no. Don't risk the lives of the children.

no i didn't actaully because that was toward the edward comment. sorry, i must've been not as clrea.

That's hypicoratical don't you think? oh he can kill other people but not teenagers. in the end, isn't it a human life that was cost? so why should it matter if it was a drunkie than a teenager?

it's fine all the same. I think you are overlooking the cullens. not only have they GIVEN UP human life so they do not feel guilt for something that is supposed to be a natural path to them which makes them even all the more strong to me that they are able to resist something so delicious, but they are are strong and capable of interacting with any human without killing them. they [humans] may tempt them whereever they are, but Jasper would never hurt any of them. For alice, for himself, for carlisle and his other sibilings. i think you should give him more credit than that?
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Re: Jasper Hale

Postby Amivera » Sun Oct 19, 2008 6:51 pm

I'm giving Jasper credit— he's one of my favorite characters. That doesn't mean, however, that he's not capable of hurting humans.

I'm questioning the storyline here. Why would they go to school if they were at the risk of hurting INNOCENT, UNDERAGE teenagers.

If you think killing an OVERAGE, STRONG, DRUNKEN man who throws away his money at bars and throws away his life is the same as killing an INNOCENT, UNDERAGE teenager who still has a FUTURE, then I question your judgement.

Yes, they're both human lives, but the Cullens should think before they risk those lives. We're going around in circles now. :P
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Re: Jasper Hale

Postby Jazziscool » Sun Oct 19, 2008 6:59 pm

Hmmm, Amevira has a good point. Of coarse I think they go to school to stay inconspisuous, because you know they're young, the law is they have to go to school, blah blah blah. Also, Jasper would go anywhere Alice would.
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Re: Jasper Hale

Postby Amethyst1 » Sun Oct 19, 2008 7:02 pm

i'll give you that, it's quite irrational to find vampires at a school but that's the whole beginning. where Bella meets edward and the cullens. so that's why the vampires are there. the point of them being there to start the story. and i like it.

question it all you want. i happen to not care whether a vampire kills a human or not. really, if i met jasper or a vampire (and i am talking about SM's vampires), i'd proberly say 'help yourself" -- okay, that sounds a little cold. i don't know. LOL!! but i am serious though. i am glad the cullen's gave up humans but it's their natural food source. i mean, i don't see how i could give up delicious mouthwatering steak or BBQ'd meat to live on soy and other vegan products *shudder*
here's the way i see it. HUMANS are cruel, if some of us are so far-fetched that we'd murder each other for stupid reasons, why question Mr. Jasper what he eats?

hmm..yeah, we are actaully. lol
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Re: Jasper Hale

Postby Jazziscool » Sun Oct 19, 2008 7:05 pm

malaz wrote:i'll give you that, it's quite irrational to find vampires at a school but that's the whole beginning. where Bella meets edward and the cullens. so that's why the vampires are there. the point of them being there to start the story. and i like it.

question it all you want. i happen to not care whether a vampire kills a human or not. really, if i met jasper or a vampire (and i am talking about SM's vampires), i'd proberly say 'help yourself" -- okay, that sounds a little cold. i don't know. LOL!! but i am serious though. i am glad the cullen's gave up humans but it's their natural food source. i mean, i don't see how i could give up delicious mouthwatering steak or BBQ'd meat to live on soy and other vegan products *shudder*
here's the way i see it. HUMANS are cruel, if some of us are so far-fetched that we'd murder each other for stupid reasons, why question Mr. Jasper what he eats?

hmm..yeah, we are actaully. lol


:lol: Ditto
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